Thread: A Message From John Bailey On Cormorants

Don't start on the otters ***, they are more entitled to the fish in our waters than we are, anyone that thinks otters are damaging fish stocks needs to have their tackle removed and shown the way back to the dark ages, if you are lucky enough to have otters on "your" water be thankful because your water must be in a healthy state...The highlight of any fishing trip is if i am lucky enough to see one sometimes a few playing, stunning animals with more intelligence than most humans.

As for cormorants, i would happily blow every one of them out the sky because the do not belong here and cause nothing but destruction wherever they fish and roost, it is bad enough watching them hoover up stocked rainbows but when you have seen one eat two lovely grayling of approx 3lb each within 5 minutes of each other you realise the damage these b******s are doing to all fish on all waters up and down the country, nowhere is safe and their numbers are only going to increase.

Originally Posted by lipslicker

I am trying to think of a river in London, or even near it, with otters, cormorants, gosanders, amazing amounts of wild trout and a cheap license, and I am thinking you might be tripping, LOL

I didn't mention goosanders or cormorants, only otters. The cost is low. But anglers often see (or don't see) what they want.

The carp angler I spoke to probably couldn’t give a monkeys about cormorants taking trout but is very unhappy about otters killing a specimen carp he was hoping to catch. We a generally only concerned with what ‘affects’ us.

You could argue that trout and cormorants are simply two wild species and if one predates the other to extinction then that is purely nature taking it’s course. Anything we do to intervene, we call conservation but in reality we are trying to manage nature to meet our own wants.

Originally Posted by pentlandflyman

As for cormorants, i would happily blow every one of them out the sky because the do not belong here and cause nothing but destruction wherever they fish and roost,

That’s quite funny. Wild animals with wings to travel wherever they please “do not belong here”

Would you say the same about humans from other countries?

Originally Posted by pentlandflyman

...do not belong here...

How do you figure cormorants do not belong here?

Col

Originally Posted by morayfisher

The carp angler I spoke to probably couldn’t give a monkeys about cormorants taking trout but is very unhappy about otters killing a specimen carp he was hoping to catch. We a generally only concerned with what ‘affects’ us.

You could argue that trout and cormorants are simply two wild species and if one predates the other to extinction then that is purely nature taking it’s course. Anything we do to intervene, we call conservation but in reality we are trying to manage nature to meet our own wants.

I agree 100 percent. It's all about personal self-interest and not about 'conservation' at all.

When I see anglers who also want to conserve the rabies virus, the garden slug, the greenfly, and the Scottish midge I may start to believe their conservationist credentials. Not until then.

Cormorant - Wikipedia

Originally Posted by morayfisher

two wild species and if one predates the other to extinction then that is purely nature taking it’s course...

Nature doesn't do it that way, though. Predator numbers are controlled by prey numbers, not the other way round.



If a predator's prey became extinct, so would the predator, unless it found a different food source.

And numbers and biomass of each follow a pattern...





I suspect we have more inland cormorants these days because we are not allowed to shoot them on sight as perhaps we once did, and also because we put out loads of food for them, in the form of heavily stocked, artificial fisheries - so they have increased survival rates. And then, when we chase them away from our artificial fisheries, the increased numbers have no option but to descend on wild waters... causing real problems on some of them. As usual, it is our own meddling that is behind it. What we are saying to the bird lobby is: "Sorry, but we have accidentally generated extra inland cormorants, so would it be OK if we shot all the extra ones that we are responsible for?"

Col

Originally Posted by Cap'n Fishy

How do you figure cormorants do not belong here?

Col

Originally Posted by morayfisher

That’s quite funny. Wild animals with wings to travel wherever they please “do not belong here”

Would you say the same about humans from other countries?

They are sea birds, sea birds do not belong inland...and yes, but this isn't a discussion about immigrants from certain countries that only come here to beg and steal.

And i know cormorants are not to blame, their own food stocks have been decimated by humans and they have moved inland to feed, any human would do the same thing to survive. It is a man made problem but it cannot go on so unless the seas suddenly replenish themselves with huge amounts of fish so these birds can move back to the coasts we need to control the numbers before there are no fresh water fish left either.