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  1. #41
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    North East Wales
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    Default Re: A Message From John Bailey On Cormorants

    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Angler View Post
    Yeah, everyone says that. Just like everyone says it's the cormorants mate. A river I fish has otters - the club members prate on about it. Yet the river is stuffed with trout.
    We have otters on our local rivers but they're not a big issue and we're generally pleased to see them. Apart from females with young, otters are nomadic, they stay for a while, catch a few fish and then move on. OK you occasionally get a sea trout pool disturbed at night but it's not a huge problem. The difference with carp fisheries is that there's no reason for the otters to move on with overstocked water. Otters do seem to deter mink.

    By comparison, a brood of goosanders, say 10 birds, will eat around 60 juvenile salmonids a day which is roughly 6,000 fish lost in the 3 months odd between hatching and dispersal. There are over 1,000 pairs in Wales now so thats possibly 6 million juvenile fish lost! There were no goosanders breeding in Wales in 1970 so that's an increasing pressure on threatened salmonids that almost exactly mirrors the decline in salmon over the past 25-30 years. Possibly coincidental, probably not!
    “There is no more lovely country than Monmouthshire in early spring. Nowhere do the larks sing quite so passionately, as if somehow inspired by the Welsh themselves. There is a blackbird on every thorn and a cock chaffinch, a twink as they call him there, on every bush...... It moved me profoundly. I had been spared to see another spring, and I thank God for it.”

    Oliver Kite
    “A Spring Day on the Usk”
    A Fisherman’s Diary

  2. #42
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
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    London
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    Default Re: A Message From John Bailey On Cormorants

    Quote Originally Posted by Cap'n Fishy View Post
    They have spread here because we are geographically part of Europe. Twenty two miles of English Channel is not a barrier to a flying water bird. The whole 'European' thing is not in itself an excuse to shoot them any more than it is an excuse to shoot any species that colonises our islands naturally. I am not arguing against controlling their numbers, just against dodgy reasons for doing it... and having a bit of banter along the way... if you understand banter?
    Come on cap, you just misread me. I too think there is no evidence to support shooting. And DEFRA will certainly take that into account.

  3. #43

    Default Re: A Message From John Bailey On Cormorants

    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Angler View Post
    Come on cap, you just misread me. I too think there is no evidence to support shooting. And DEFRA will certainly take that into account.
    I think you misread me. My post #31 - I wasn't taking a pop at what you said. I was just adding to it, in reply to all the Gammon/Brexit/xenophobe types who are trying to say that we need to eradicate cormorants, because they are Romanian immigrants or whatever.

    I didn't say there is no evidence to support shooting. There is an argument to be made... but like most arguments of the type, a lot depends on your own interests. Our club water gets hammered by cormorants on a regular basis. We are effectively paying thousands of pounds to feed cormorants, which, after being fed by us, go off and make baby cormorants... which then go off and eat fish other people have paid for. We apply for and get a license to shoot one each year. That at least allows us to have a man with a gun on the water looking to use our license, which hopefully deters them... for a while. 'Tis a can o' wurrims, no doubt about it.

    Then, as Sewinbasher says, Goosanders team-up to wipe out whole populations of salmon fry and parr from rivers. I have seen them doing it. Does it justify us blasting them willy-nilly? Dunno?
    Please note that any views expressed in this post may be those of the
    originator and do not necessarily reflect those of the reader.

  4. #44
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
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    Default Re: A Message From John Bailey On Cormorants

    Quote Originally Posted by Cap'n Fishy View Post
    I think you misread me. My post #31 - I wasn't taking a pop at what you said. I was just adding to it, in reply to all the Gammon/Brexit/xenophobe types who are trying to say that we need to eradicate cormorants, because they are Romanian immigrants or whatever.
    Ok cap, pax. Glad we're on the same side.

    Goosanders I have no experience of. Only ever seen a couple - on the Ribble.

    On the evidence, I mean published research. There's actually very little that applies to the UK, most is in Denmark. That doesn't mean the cormorants don't wreak havoc somewhere, but without hard evidence (ie not just the word of anglers) no govt will ever sanction general shooting of them.

    Anyway, I'll try and put something together for my blog about it, when I manage to get round to it.

  5. #45

    Default Re: A Message From John Bailey On Cormorants

    There was a group of about 25 goosanders on the Ouse above York last winter that I used to see every day, probably there again, we moved in summer. I only see the odd cormorant so I'd have to agree that goosanders could be a bigger problem, at least around here.

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