Bridge v mirrorless

4wings

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I have a couple of Nikon DSLR's that I use along with a Panasonic Lumix DMC1000 Bridge camera I enjoy using this and it goes most places with me, my notebook cameras are a Fuji X20 and a small Sony Cybershot DSC-W50 which goes in her handbag or in the glove box.
I would love a mirrorless camera as many of them will take other manufacturers lenses, like my old Nikkor and Takumars (and a Rokkor that I foolishly could not part with)
I like my DSLR because I know what it will do and it produces excellent photos.
I like my Lumix for its Leica lens and it takes amazing Macro shots with my Raynox attachment.
The Fuji is in the style of a Leica and it just is light and handleable with a super lens.
They can all take video. Not sure about the Nikon.
 

4wings

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Okay guys, firstly, Thank you all very much for the replies and the feedback!
I am probably going to go with a Canon EOS 600D with a 15 to 135mm lens, I can pick one up brand new for just over $1000NZ, that is around 500 quid. I like the look and the feel of some of the mirrorless cameras but the cost of a good one simply rules it out for me.
I did consider the bridge option, but both the ones I looked at did not "feel right" in my hand, if that makes any sense?
Anyway, once I get the camera and get a chance to do a few exploratory shots I will post a few on here and you can all tell me what I am doing wrong:thumbs: After all if you don't know what's wrong it's difficult to fix it.
Once again thanks for all the replies, I think I learned at least a little from almost all of them.
All the best.
Mike
LENSES, check out the quality on DPreview or Ken Rockwell. Just because it has a big makers name does not mean its their best effort in a particular lens.
 

Hardrar

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Hi Guys, as some of you know I have been looking at getting a low range SLR camera, but as part of my research I have found some interesting cameras that are not SLR but do seem to be a step up from a point a shoot.
The Canon 50x zoom bridge camera looks good, has anyone tried one, any comments or feed back?
The other one that I have found is a mirrorless camera, I think it was a Sony NEX? does anyone know anything about these? They claim to be top quality and close to an SLR but without the bulk?
Sorry for all the questions, but the more I look into stepping up to a better camera the more confusing it becomes!:eek:mg:
All the best.
Mike
I feel a DSLR would be the best way forward, as to buy into a good mirrorless system, is going to cost a fair bit more. There are pros and cons with both. The biggest issue with DSLR is they are heavy cumbersome systems, but the optical viewfinder finder is a big plus.
If you buy a moderate priced body you can always upgrade later and any lenses you buy will still fit that system.
I have the Olympus micro 4/3 system, with Pen F bodies, which is much more portable and has a range of Pro grade lenses for it but it’s not cheap and the menu system takes a long time to master, as it has a vast number of features on it.
My Wife has the Pro grade Canon DSLR system and the menus are much more intuitive on it than my Pen Fs
Pro grade fixed lens zooms do have the advantage of portability though and the best camera is always the one you have with you!!!
 

ps3737

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" The biggest issue with DSLR is they are heavy cumbersome systems, but the optical viewfinder finder is a big plus."
I would rate the mirrorless EVF/LCD as one of the biggest steps forward in photography over the awful tunnel vision contraptions on 99% of SLRs. It like driving in the dark by memory without headights. My experience is with Olympus OM-D and they are brilliant because you can set up the EVF to show you excactly what your settings will produce in the finished image. You can simply look at the viewfinder image and change the settings ( aperture or shutter) to lighten or darken it to what you want then press the button. No optical finder can do that - and you then also find out that standard advice like "open up 1.5 stops for backlighting" is completely useless when you can see on the finder that it takes 3 or even 4 stops to do the job.
Not sure but may get the same exposure advantage in a bridge camera viewfinder - best to check one out in a store to see if will do the trick for you. It makes a huge difference to you shooting speed and confidence.
 

Hardrar

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" The biggest issue with DSLR is they are heavy cumbersome systems, but the optical viewfinder finder is a big plus."
I would rate the mirrorless EVF/LCD as one of the biggest steps forward in photography over the awful tunnel vision contraptions on 99% of SLRs. It like driving in the dark by memory without headights. My experience is with Olympus OM-D and they are brilliant because you can set up the EVF to show you excactly what your settings will produce in the finished image. You can simply look at the viewfinder image and change the settings ( aperture or shutter) to lighten or darken it to what you want then press the button. No optical finder can do that - and you then also find out that standard advice like "open up 1.5 stops for backlighting" is completely useless when you can see on the finder that it takes 3 or even 4 stops to do the job.
Not sure but may get the same exposure advantage in a bridge camera viewfinder - best to check one out in a store to see if will do the trick for you. It makes a huge difference to you shooting speed and confidence.
I’d second this, I have the Olympus m4/3 system based on the Pen F bodies, not cheap, really compact, but not fiddly and a huge range of features, that are so useful in practice, when your used to them.The Zuiko lenses are always razor sharp and produce pleasing image tones.
 

Cap'n Fishy

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" The biggest issue with DSLR is they are heavy cumbersome systems, but the optical viewfinder finder is a big plus."
I would rate the mirrorless EVF/LCD as one of the biggest steps forward in photography over the awful tunnel vision contraptions on 99% of SLRs. It like driving in the dark by memory without headights. My experience is with Olympus OM-D and they are brilliant because you can set up the EVF to show you excactly what your settings will produce in the finished image. You can simply look at the viewfinder image and change the settings ( aperture or shutter) to lighten or darken it to what you want then press the button. No optical finder can do that - and you then also find out that standard advice like "open up 1.5 stops for backlighting" is completely useless when you can see on the finder that it takes 3 or even 4 stops to do the job.
Not sure but may get the same exposure advantage in a bridge camera viewfinder - best to check one out in a store to see if will do the trick for you. It makes a huge difference to you shooting speed and confidence.

At the end of the day, we have loads of options and we can all choose what we like to use for whatever reason we like. What one person finds a disadvantage, another person finds to be an advantage. I see no point in trying to sell our own preferences to anyone else. It's like SUV owners trying to persuade town car owners to buy an SUV. What one person likes, another dislikes. Use what you like to use and post up the results you get with it. Let the images speak for themselves.

Give useful things like focal length, aperture, shutter speed, ISO and EV comp. Leave out irrelevant details like brand and model of camera - we all use what we choose for our own preferences.

Col
 
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ps3737

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At the end of the day, we have loads of options and we can all choose what we like to use for whatever reason we like. What one person finds a disadvantage, another person finds to be an advantage. I see no point in trying to sell our own preferences to anyone else. It's like SUV owners trying to persuade town car owners to buy an SUV. What one person likes, another dislikes. Use what you like to use and post up the results you get with it. Let the images speak for themselves.

Give useful things like focal length, aperture, shutter speed, ISO and EV comp. Leave out irrelevant details like brand and model of camera - we all use what we choose for our own preferences.

Col
To say I merely mentioned Olympus to put in context as my particular realm of experience (oh and Panasonic as well) - other brands most certainly probably do things differently. As to selling preferences I think it is worthwhile to point out after nearly 100 years of optical viewfinders that mirrorless and EVF has had plenty of detractors in the last ten years working from a position of ignorance or hostility who present their opinions that often conflict with the truth.
I think we are mature enough to be be able to espouse whatever equipment we prefer to work with as every system has it own has it advantages, much as some prefer dry fly versus nymph or Sage versus Hardy ... at the end of the day the goal to share our experiences to further our photographic skills to capture the sport we enjoy in common.
 

Hardrar

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From the OPs point of view, who doesn’t say what his “ budget” actually is, but indicates towards the lower end. A Dslr would offer much better value, more for your money, than an equivalent mirrorless system, but with the disadvantage of more bulk and weight.
However My Wife has a Canon D1 X 11 plus a load of lenses and also the Canon compact sx 740, she uses the latter the most and has produced some stunning images with it, slips in the pocket, fast to use and 40x zoom. These are commonly used by professional vloggers and freelance press, due to portability and quality of images.
Not pushing just Canon, as Nikon, Lumix, Leica, Pentax and many others have equivalents.
It is a bewildering choice.
 
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caeran

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+1 for the Canon Sx720

It might be the wee wifey’s camera ( rather patronising doncha ya think?)

I wanted a camera that I could slip into my pocket and whilst out on the riverbank or in the country I could zoom in on wee birds and bring them closer.
I still regard these as “ snaps” but £ for£ it’s very good
Still learning what it can do but tend to leave it on Auto and enjoy using it

Anyhow will let you get on with your my lense is bigger than your lens comp.

A long discussion that was never going to reach agreement full of marginal details


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Cap'n Fishy

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every system has it own has it advantages, much as some prefer dry fly versus nymph or Sage versus Hardy ... at the end of the day the goal to share our experiences to further our photographic skills to capture the sport we enjoy in common.

That's my point - every system has it's advantages and disadvantages. Every photographer picks the one that he prefers. So, is there any point in pushing what one person prefers when it might be the total opposite of what the person he is pushing it to prefers? Again and again folk go on about the bulk of a dSLR being a disadvantage. I don't see it as a disadvantage. It's a full size camera that sits in the hand so the fingers are over the buttons, ready to press them on the fly. That's the whole point of it. You can't do that with a compact camera. Then again, you can't stick a dSLR in your pocket. There is no one size fits all. We all pick what we prefer.

Is there any point in a dry fly man trying to tell a nymph fisher he should be fishing dry fly? Is there any point in a Sage user pushing Sage to a Hardy user?

Let's face it, we all use cameras that give us good results these days. And the majority of images around the world are now taken with mobile phones, not bridge or mirrorless or dSLR or film cameras. When someone posts an image, what are others interested in? Is it the focal length, aperture, shutter speed, ISO and EV comp, or is it the brand of camera it was taken with? Add to that... it could be argued that the look of the final image owes more to the software it was processed with than to the brand and model of camera it was taken with!

If someone posts a photo of a good trout, folk will be interested in where it was caught, what method it was caught with and what fly pattern it was caught on. I doubt they will be the slightest bit interested in the brand of rod and reel it was caught with. Just sayin'...
 
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green man

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I would encourage anyone who hasn't actually shot mirrorless to try one, rather than just dismiss them, or take the word of people who haven't tried them.

For most of my career I was shooting semi-professionally (ie. not full-time, maybe two days a month) for print and latterly digital media. Admittedly, most of my work was architectural and corporate in nature - 'places and people' shots that didn't involve action of any sort, so my views are based on that.

I switched from a Canon 5DmkIII and a Nikon D810 to a Fuji X-T1 about seven years ago. I ran tests between the three cameras and the 16mpx APS-C sensor of the Fuji produced sharper images and more detail than the Nikon, but was admittedly shaded by the Canon, but not to any degree that a client would question.

Having sworn that I would NEVER use an EVF, I realised how wrong I was. The EVF is a see-in-the-dark marvel, with no lag (on Fuji and Sony) and giving a live view of the actual camera settings, making shooting quicker and more intuitive.

I've retired now, but since buying the Fuji I almost never shot anything but JPEG - Fuji's image quality and film-like colour and b&w film simulations are awesome, which means more time to enjoy shooting and less time in front of a computer. That said, I've seen remarkable recovery shots from a Fuji X camera where the RAW files were literally black and the recovered files of acceptable quality for publication, with almost no digital artefacts.

Fuji's lenses (as well as Sony's, I believe) are solid lumps of metal and as a maker of lenses for Hasselblad the glass is second to none. They are expensive compared to plastic DSLR lenses. Battery life is also poor compared to DSLR, but pros carry two bodies (or more) and I know of top, top, wedding photographers (who dare not miss a moment) who use mirrorless exclusively.

The latest Fuji X-T4 is now as fast as a DSLR for action photography, with a faster frame rate and near silent 'shutter'. It costs a lot of money to switch systems, but for anyone starting out and wanting a decent platform on which to build, I'd check out Sony (full frame), Olympus (micro four thirds) and Fuji (APS-C) and not assume that DSLR is superior just because a few people who are reluctant to change, and haven't even tried mirrorless, say so.

For those on a budget, who don't need extreme telephoto, the Fuji X-100V is an outstanding pocket camera, to which expansion lenses can be added, to go wider or for portraits. It's a remarkable little camera that seems to give perfect exposures, in difficult light, almost every time.

You can tell I'm a Fuji fan 😜 , but most of all I believe that mirrorless is replacing DSLR, as inevitably as electric cars are making the combustion engine obsolete. I can't be wrong, otherwise Nikon and Canon wouldn't be playing catch-up with Sony and Fuji (and Leica) and producing pro-quality mirrorless products.
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Cap'n Fishy

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... and not assume that DSLR is superior just because a few people who are reluctant to change, and haven't even tried mirrorless, say so.

Who are you speaking to here? This is a 9-year old thread that has been well past its use-by date or several years, thanks to the latest developments in mirrorless technology.

I don't think there is anyone present that fits your description above? Is there?

We are just fishermen who take a few photos and post them up to this forum. Please feel free to add your own, by the way...

I'd be happy enough to give mirrorless a go. However, I have a collection of Canon EF lenses, built up over the past 15 years. I realise I can put them on a new Canon R-mount mirrorless body with the aid of an adaptor, but the whole point of the new body is to pair it with the new R mount lenses so each gets the best out the other. So, I doubt I will get any great advantage if I trade in my dSLR body for a mirrorless body to put on my EF lenses?

I am happy with the results I get with the kit I have, so why should I spend a lot of money changing the entire lot of it, just to become trendy? What I have takes decent photographs, after-all. That is all that lies at the end of the process, unless you are one of the fanboys who takes his camera to bed with him at night (and I know one or two of them, to be fair :whistle:). I have thought about hiring a Canon R body and EF adaptor for a day. I would probably need to hire an R lens as well, so I can look for any improvement. Just out of curiosity, like. And there isn't much point in doing it until I am free to travel somewhere I can take a few shots to make a good comparison.

Anyhoo, I think it is just a waste of anyone's time trying to sell cameras to fishing members on this forum. There are far better places for that. This should be a place to stick up what photos you have taken and add the shot details... and to put up things like 'how to' techniques, such as how to get good results when photographing flies and getting action shots.

A couple of recent photos of mine...

560 mm, f8, ISO 2500, 1/500 s


DunsapieLoch15Dec20_6376.jpg


85 mm f2, ISO 320, 1/2000 s

Buchanty02Oct20_3319.jpg


Make and type of camera are of no interest to anyone else....

Anyone looking to spend a lot of money on a completely new system will not be coming here to do their research if they are sensible! 🤪
 

wobbly face

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Latest mirrorless FUJI: https://www.wexphotovideo.com/fujif...NcITlFM3olZhdd1ChazHApgHC0YW_IYUaAg-VEALw_wcB

Now FUJI lens: GF mount: https://www.wexphotovideo.com/fujifilm-gf-mount/
Not much change from £8,000.00.

Photo threads a plenty arguing between Canon or Nikon without for going mirrorless or bridge. Full frame, 3/4 or whatever crop!
I'm still trying to get my headache around F stops, ISO and shutter speed! :eek:
Mobile phone camera anyone??? Seen an app that make using your mobile like a proper camera, can alter ISO, shutter speed and such (there's the headache again). Plus, there is a free Adobe Lightroom app for mobiles for post shot processing. Why do I watch Youtube???
 

green man

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Who are you speaking to here? This is a 9-year old thread that has been well past its use-by date or several years, thanks to the latest developments in mirrorless technology.

People are still looking at it, which is why there are several posts (before mine) from 2021. Sadly, after nine years, you're still making comments like the one below, that mirrorless is 'trendy'.

I don't think there is anyone present that fits your description above? Is there?

Now, let me think... :unsure:

I am happy with the results I get with the kit I have, so why should I spend a lot of money changing the entire lot of it, just to become trendy?

The thread might have moved on, but that comment betrays the fact that you haven't. I'm surprised you can make such a dismissive comment about a system that you haven't even used. There's nothing 'trendy' about mirrorless. People are using these systems to make a living - they didn't ditch their DSLRs to be trendy.

Make and type of camera are of no interest to anyone else....

Anyone looking to spend a lot of money on a completely new system will not be coming here to do their research if they are sensible! 🤪

Half the threads on here are from people looking for advice about gear. Some are still dismissing mirrorless systems, or have concerns about them, for the same reason they did nine years ago.

I'm as passionate about mirrorless as you are about holding onto your DSLR gear. There's room for both of us, so long as we are objective. I've used both systems professionally and had no regrets about making the switch. For a lot of DSLR users it's difficult to let go of long-held beliefs that (next to large format) DSLR is the only professional choice. If my comments reassure anyone that if they want top quality pictures, the choice doesn't have to be a DSLR, then I've offered something for them to think about.
.
 

Cap'n Fishy

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you're still making comments like the one below, that mirrorless is 'trendy'.

Yeh - because that is the trend. The trend is away from dSLRs and towards mirrorless. I get that. It's not that folk who already have good gear are refusing to 'move on', as you put it, the question is whether it is worth their while making a massive change to their gear just to have the latest toys.

The thread might have moved on, but that comment betrays the fact that you haven't.

I already told you I can't change to mirrorless for the very good reason I explained - my gear is built round a collection of EF lenses, which are tied to dSLRs (or film SLRs). Simple. As I said, I would be happy to try out a mirrorless and might try hiring one with an RF lens to see how it compares. But the big question is whether I would see any significant improvement in image quality over what I get now. If I don't then it is not worth spending 1000s of pounds and going through the massive faff of selling all my current kit, just to get the latest bells and whistles. End of the day, the product is a photograph, not a box of electronics.

I'm surprised you can make such a dismissive comment about a system that you haven't even used.

I'm not being dismissive in the slightest. And I don't see anyone else being dismissive of mirrorless cameras. On the contrary, it's you mirrorless users that are being dismissive of dSLR users! WTF?

Half the threads on here are from people looking for advice about gear.

I had a quick look back - been about one thread asking for that kind of advice since 2013. (One or two others asking for things like cheap waterproof compacts don't count) So, not half... by a long chalk. That lack of traffic in recent years tells me that folk have got themselves sorted out. They don't need to be preached to. If they need to ask, they will ask... but they are not asking. If they did ask, my advice would be to go and seek advice on photography forums and photographic gear review sites, rather than on a fishing forum! But I think they already know to do that... 😜

As for this thread, it died in December 2012. It lay peacefully these past 9 years until it was resurrected last month by Richard W for the sole purpose of having a pop at dSLR users! So stick that in your pipe and smoke it!

Some are still dismissing mirrorless systems, or have concerns about them, for the same reason they did nine years ago.

Are they? Examples?

I'm as passionate about mirrorless as you are about holding onto your DSLR gear.

I'm not, though, that's the thing I keep trying to explain. They changed the lens mount to make a completely new system of mirrorless bodies and lenses. I'm left with my EF lenses. However, it's not a problem because they work on a dSLR. I'm not changing because there is absolutely no need to change purely to keep up with the latest developments. Yer man who likes to look down his nose at dSLR users still uses film. Ask him why he doesn't sell all his gear and buy a mirrorless system.

There's room for both of us, so long as we are objective.

I agree absolutely. I just don't think this is the place to be preachy about specific brands of gear... Fuji and Olympus fanboys, for example. And if there is room for both of us, then surely that means not trying to preach to dSLR users that they should switch to mirrorless?

I guess I am wary of folk who just talk about their gear without posting images. Do you never have anything to contribute to the galleries on here?
 
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4wings

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Cap'n Fishy

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Even that is 5 years out of date now. That's an age in digital technology. The question is, what will be the next type of digital camera? The one that comes after mirrorless? All the mirrorless users will need to decide whether to stay put and become objects of ridicule from those who buy the new thing, or to sell-up and get the next big thing... 😜
 

4wings

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Downside? battery life. I carry two spares for my little Fuji and you really need them with some of the
Mirrorless cameras also they need to be "makers" batteries to have all the necessary contacts and
they are not cheap.
 

Cap'n Fishy

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Downside? battery life. I carry two spares for my little Fuji and you really need them with some of the
Mirrorless cameras also they need to be "makers" batteries to have all the necessary contacts and
they are not cheap.

Good point. I am still using a battery that has been registering as one red light (meaning it is supposedly on its last legs and should be replaced) for about the past 10 years. And I still get 1500 shots out of a charge with it. When I went to get some shots of the otter on Dunsapie Loch, I came away with nearly 1000 images, plus some video, and I still had 40% charge in the battery I started with. (y)

Col
 

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