casts hitting line!!

ohanzee

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James,

I think that we would see the same with an oval. In fact I don't know where that "constant tension" motto comes from.

If you take Lasse's first vid as 'a firm stop and pause', (it not a sharp stop but it illustrates) then try to cast by softening the stop with a continual circular movement you get a... continual movement, a very, very narrow oval cast if you like,
The tip may well be counter flexing in the same way, i don't know but the forward and back casts flow into one movement,
When i do this i see a distinct difference in smoothness and line tension, no sags and less energy, i could only attribute this to the lack of pause.
 
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torrotxo

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If you take Lasse's first vid as 'a firm stop and pause', (it not a sharp stop but it illustrates) then try to cast by softening the stop with a continual circular movement you get a... continual movement, a very, very narrow oval cast if you like,
The tip may well be counter flexing in the same way, i don't know but the forward and back casts flow into one movement,
When i do this i see a distinct difference in smoothness and line tension, no sags and less energy, i could only attribute this to the lack of pause.
Yes, I know what an oval cast is. What I doubt is that it keeps the rod bent, if that's your point. An oval implies drifting instead of waiting while the line unrolls, and a drift doesn't add tension IMHO.
 

Guest666

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Hi Aitor,

Have you got a slo-mo of an oval? I've just been wafting an MPR about and I'm not sure, doesn't immediately look like I get RSP2 though.

All the best, James

Depends what you mean by constant tension, I was talking about rod leg tension. I've looked at single speys with Aitor and the rod slowly unloads.
 

ohanzee

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A nonsense statement Alan. Tension in the rod leg is never consistent it varies with loop momentum and using a flexible rod increases the effort

Mine is a nonsense statement?:D if you have ever tried to cast with a rigid rod you would notice it takes a bit of effort and adjustment to keep the cast smooth, mostly in keeping a straight tip path,
An over bendy rod also uses effort, what we need is a flex that matches the weight we cast, this makes it both easier to control, keep on a straight path, and uses less effort,

You would suggest otherwise?
 
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ohanzee

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Yes, I know what an oval cast is. What I doubt is that it keeps the rod bent, if that's your point. An oval implies drifting instead of waiting while the line unrolls, and a drift doesn't add tension IMHO.

This would be good, what i'd expect is not that it doesn't happen, but that it happens less,

I'm thinking if it didn't an oval cast wouldn't be any more fluid than an overhead cast.

The pause, or lack of it is where the interesting part lies, i think a good tip for any cast is the rod tip should always be moving, directed and deliberately doing something(although sometimes that is not moving)
 
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torrotxo

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Depends what you mean by constant tension, I was talking about rod leg tension. I've looked at single speys with Aitor and the rod slowly unloads.
Could be this clip, Vince? I'd say the rod unloads as usual:

[ame]https://vimeo.com/66387625[/ame]
 

paddy5

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That unloading of the rod during the sweep of the single spey has been my biggest hurdle in gaining true proficiency with the cast, Robert Gillespies incline exercise has proved invaluable in this regard, in fact hope to get some lessons from him in the next few weeks to really bring it all together.
 

James9118

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I've looked at single speys with Aitor and the rod slowly unloads.

My oval cast is very different from a switch or other spey (no lift as such, it just goes round and round). Anyway I'm getting pulled into arguing for the other side here, you generally cannot catch the counterflex to use it in the next stroke.
 

ohanzee

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My oval cast is very different from a switch or other spey (no lift as such, it just goes round and round). Anyway I'm getting pulled into arguing for the other side here, you generally cannot catch the counterflex to use it in the next stroke.

Is it not about not having counter flex in the first place? or rather minimising the pause and counter flex to a point of greater efficiency…

i imagine you always get a bit as the weight of line rolls off the tip, but with gentle handling and good timing do we not all try to do this when false casting?
 

James9118

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I will try to shoot something.

Hi Aitor,

I've just made a very poor quality video of my MPR oval cast. I still don't think the rod gets to RSP2, although it's quite hard to see as it doesn't bend much. The cast was very, very fast and on video it looks like pull-back just blends seamlessly into the opposite stroke on each change of direction.

Pretty extreme though :D:cool:
 

James9118

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Is it not about not having counter flex in the first place? or rather minimising the pause and counter flex to a point of greater efficiency…

i imagine you always get a bit as the weight of line rolls off the tip, but with gentle handling and good timing do we not all try to do this when false casting?

I'm missing your point here. I contended that you cannot 'catch' the counterflex and use it as a starting rod-bend in the next stroke - the videos I posted (of Aitor) showed just how early counteflex occurs after loop formation.

I said it may be possible to catch it using a oval cast but I wasn't sure. I've now made a slow-mo video of a fairly extreme (in terms of speed) oval, and I believe I can blend the counterflex into the next stroke. Whether I'd ever want to cast like this over water is another question. :whistle:
 

torrotxo

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That unloading of the rod during the sweep of the single spey has been my biggest hurdle in gaining true proficiency with the cast, Robert Gillespies incline exercise has proved invaluable in this regard, in fact hope to get some lessons from him in the next few weeks to really bring it all together.
If you are having problems with your single spey it's better to look for another hurdle.
I am quite sure that, filmed in slo-mo, even Gillespie himself would see his rod unloading during repositioning.
It could be that it only happens to **** casters like myself, but a pro like Ed Ward changed his mind the first time he saw footage of himself from a high speed camera.:whistle:
 

Guest666

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Could be this clip, Vince? I'd say the rod unloads as usual:

That's the one Aitor, the rod unloads as usual for a SS but slow compared to an overhead and with very little (if any) counterflex

---------- Post added at 07:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:41 PM ----------

My oval cast is very different from a switch or other spey (no lift as such, it just goes round and round). Anyway I'm getting pulled into arguing for the other side here, you generally cannot catch the counterflex to use it in the next stroke.

Agreed about the counterflex, but if you are casting like this:

Fly Casting with Jim Williams | Eat, Sleep, Fish

then the bend in the rod tip will change direction
 

torrotxo

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Hi Aitor,

I've just made a very poor quality video of my MPR oval cast. I still don't think the rod gets to RSP2, although it's quite hard to see as it doesn't bend much. The cast was very, very fast and on video it looks like pull-back just blends seamlessly into the opposite stroke on each change of direction.

Pretty extreme though :D:cool:
Hi there!

I have shot some clips this evening. I will try to make something better tomorrow. I see no noticeable bend.
 

paddy5

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If you are having problems with your single spey it's better to look for another hurdle.
I am quite sure that, filmed in slo-mo, even Gillespie himself would see his rod unloading during repositioning.
It could be that it only happens to **** casters like myself, but a pro like Ed Ward changed his mind the first time he saw footage of himself from a high speed camera.:whistle:

Of course the rod unloads, its that disconnection which throws me ,the incline exercise helps to overcome the counter instinctive nature of the technique, my rhythm gets thrown eight out of ten times, Will fill you in on my progress after a session with the man himself.
 

ohanzee

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I'm missing your point here. I contended that you cannot 'catch' the counterflex and use it as a starting rod-bend in the next stroke - the videos I posted (of Aitor) showed just how early counteflex occurs after loop formation.

I said it may be possible to catch it using a oval cast but I wasn't sure. I've now made a slow-mo video of a fairly extreme (in terms of speed) oval, and I believe I can blend the counterflex into the next stroke. Whether I'd ever want to cast like this over water is another question. :whistle:

I agree you cannot catch the counter flex, when you think about it for a moment it is pretty obvious, maybe with a mega slow rod or something,

Now, tighten your oval cast so that the middle of it is a straight stroke, and look how smooth your cast is, should be nearly as smooth as mine ha:)
 
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torrotxo

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I agree you cannot catch the counter flex, when you think about it for a moment it is pretty obvious, maybe with a mega slow rod or something,

Now, tighten your oval cast so that the middle of it is a straight stroke, and look how smooth your cast is, should be nearly as smooth as mine ha:)
Some ovals shot this morning. Surely not as smooth as yours but the only ones available so far. :)

[ame]https://vimeo.com/110482819[/ame]
 
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