Latest Trout & Salmon, Epic article by

arkle

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Paul Caslin. superb photo's of some of his phenomenal trout flies. Not to mention the text. & there's plenty of other stuff there from the regular suspects.
 

ackroyd

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I was very interested in this article too, particularly in the Picric Peter Muddler at the bottom of p. 61. There it is said that the head is "Deer hair dyed WOIGO." Now, without casting aspersions, there seem to be umpteen versions of deer-hair claiming to be dyed WOIGO. I have bought some from Rob Denson and some from Irish Fly Supplies. They are quite different and neither particularly resembles the colour shown in Caslin's specimen. Can anybody direct me to a source for this shade of WOIGO, please?
 

Wee Jimmy

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I was very interested in this article too, particularly in the Picric Peter Muddler at the bottom of p. 61. There it is said that the head is "Deer hair dyed WOIGO." Now, without casting aspersions, there seem to be umpteen versions of deer-hair claiming to be dyed WOIGO. I have bought some from Rob Denson and some from Irish Fly Supplies. They are quite different and neither particularly resembles the colour shown in Caslin's specimen. Can anybody direct me to a source for this shade of WOIGO, please?

The trouble in nailing down an exact colour is ,everyone you ask seems to have their own favourite shade of it. For example my own favourite is darker than most and was a piece I obtained from Gerry Macdonald(Artifly) who unfortunately has ceased trading. Over and above that,it is a very tricky colour to dye consistently.The patch of hide which you start off with will obviously influence the end result so we end up with several pieces each one slightly different.

I’m not absolutely certain but my understanding is the west of Ireland shade of golden olive originated from materials which had first been dyed in picric.Picric changes colour over time and exposure to water and sunlight.

When all is said and done though,it’s a lovely colour in all of its guises and they all seem to appeal to the trout...😉
 

sage5

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The trouble in nailing down an exact colour is ,everyone you ask seems to have their own favourite shade of it. For example my own favourite is darker than most and was a piece I obtained from Gerry Macdonald(Artifly) who unfortunately has ceased trading. Over and above that,it is a very tricky colour to dye consistently.The patch of hide which you start off with will obviously influence the end result so we end up with several pieces each one slightly different.

I’m not absolutely certain but my understanding is the west of Ireland shade of golden olive originated from materials which had first been dyed in picric.Picric changes colour over time and exposure to water and sunlight.

When all is said and done though,it’s a lovely colour in all of its guises and they all seem to appeal to the trout...😉
Yes Jimmy, it is a lovely colour, and your W.O.I.G.O. Kate muddler caught me a bag full of Brownies yesterday
Many thanks Duncan
 

Wee Jimmy

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Yes Jimmy, it is a lovely colour, and your W.O.I.G.O. Kate muddler caught me a bag full of Brownies yesterday
Many thanks Duncan

Glad to hear it Duncan.....👍 As soon as I saw the colour I knew straight away that it would suit a Katie muddler.
 

ian1104

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Yes Jimmy, it is a lovely colour, and your W.O.I.G.O. Kate muddler caught me a bag full of Brownies yesterday
Many thanks Duncan
I'm STILL waiting for my WOIGO deer hair to copy Jimmy's muddler (almost 4 weeks since I ordered - but I'm sure it'll be worth the wait). Jimmy, can I ask, do you tie it on a B170 so it rides a bit higher in the water, or a B175?

Thanks
Ian
 

Wee Jimmy

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I'm STILL waiting for my WOIGO deer hair to copy Jimmy's muddler (almost 4 weeks since I ordered - but I'm sure it'll be worth the wait). Jimmy, can I ask, do you tie it on a B170 so it rides a bit higher in the water, or a B175?

Thanks
Ian

I tie them mainly on 175s Ian or occasionally 160s (the wider gape of the 160 is usefull at times) Im sure a bit more experimenting with lighter wire hooks along with greasing them up would pay dividends on its day and in the right situations so I wouldn’t let that stop you.
For what it’s worth ,by and large I find that banging the head of the fly against the underside of the film ...I.e making it bulge and holding it there is usually far more productive in terms of positive hook ups,compared to scraping it along on the surface.The latter can be exactly what they are after though so I don’t neglect trying it along with different retrieve rates ,angled casts longline/short line etc over the course of the day.All part of getting tuned in to what they want...😉
 

ackroyd

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Ian1104, the problem may be that your supplier is awaiting new stock of winter roe skins. The pelage of the roe deer is completely different at this time of year. The fur you want, ideally, is winter roe taken from the dark midline on the back of the beast, preferably near the saddle. Have you thought about dyeing your own, using turmeric, for example?

I readily confess that when it comes to WOIGO, I am a bad case of OCD. But in my heart-of-hearts, I suspect I am misguided. I think much depends on the prevailing light conditions. So "be brave" is my brocard. Trial and error is the way forward, strange as it may seem.
 

ian1104

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Ian1104, the problem may be that your supplier is awaiting new stock of winter roe skins. The pelage of the roe deer is completely different at this time of year. The fur you want, ideally, is winter roe taken from the dark midline on the back of the beast, preferably near the saddle. Have you thought about dyeing your own, using turmeric, for example?

I readily confess that when it comes to WOIGO, I am a bad case of OCD. But in my heart-of-hearts, I suspect I am misguided. I think much depends on the prevailing light conditions. So "be brave" is my brocard. Trial and error is the way forward, strange as it may seem.

Hi Ackroyd,

It was indeed a case of waiting for their stock, but I have been informed that it's now in the post :D

As for dyeing my own, I just gabout get away with having materials and tackle all over the place, not sure if she'd kill me if I was to start dyeing in the sink etc!!!!

Ian
 

Wee Jimmy

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The fur you want, ideally, is winter roe taken from the dark midline on the back of the beast, preferably near the saddle.

Actually no,....you would get closer to Paul Caslins fly if you dyed a pale piece. I know Stan likes the dark centre line for hogs ,it maybe more buoyant which helps with the pop-up effect.There are other things to consider though ,such as overall colour tone you want in your fly and what you are trying to represent with it.For example, for a grouse wing hatch I prefer a paler winged hog.
 

ackroyd

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I don't dispute what you say, WJ, not in the slightest. I am but a humble follower of the great Stan Headley. And I did notice that recently in T & S he recommended a fly with white and dark roe fur. I ought perhaps to have made it clear that I was speaking of particular flies which I use such as a darkish Kate McLaren WOIGO muddler for sea-trout in Scottish lochs where the pop-up effect works for me. When I say "darkish", I mean a sort of Virginia tobacco colour rather than the orangey-yellow version of WOIGO which Paul Caslin uses. Of course, it will be much easier to dye the white fur that colour - I am just not sure that it has the same stiff pleasing texture and consistent overall length which the fur from the spine has. But I shall certainly try out your recommendation. Thank-you.
 

Wee Jimmy

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I have bought some from Rob Denson and some from Irish Fly Supplies. They are quite different and neither particularly resembles the colour shown in Caslin's specimen. Can anybody direct me to a source for this shade of WOIGO, please?

Ackroyd, I had assumed that you were seeking the brighter /lighter shade which Paul had used in the flies for his article ,from the above..?
 

Cap'n Fishy

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Hi Ackroyd,

It was indeed a case of waiting for their stock, but I have been informed that it's now in the post :D

As for dyeing my own, I just gabout get away with having materials and tackle all over the place, not sure if she'd kill me if I was to start dyeing in the sink etc!!!!

Ian

Honestly, with the acid dyes you use for fur and feather, the dye likes protein and other fly-tying materials, but it has no interest in stainless steel and ceramics. I've been doing loads of dyeing over the past couple of years and there isn't a spot of dye to be found anywhere in my kitchen. Even the white plastic spoon I use to stir the bath is still perfectly white! I carefully weigh the small amount of dye needed to get the colour and no more, and then dye the material until it has taken up all the dye and the water in the pan is almost totally clear. There is hardly anything to pour down the sink.

Here is my cooker with the stainless steel pan I use for dyeing...



... and here is my sink...



Spotless - apart from the dirt!

On the subject of WOIGO deer hair, here is my latest effort. I like the palest bits of roe as a base...



That is 80% EBEST fluo yellow : 20% Jacquard Aztec Gold.

Col
 
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ian1104

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Honestly, with the acid dyes you use for fur and feather, the dye likes protein and other fly-tying materials, but it has no interest in stainless steel and ceramics. I've been doing loads of dyeing over the past couple of years and there isn't a spot of dye to be found anywhere in my kitchen. Even the white plastic spoon I use to stir the bath is still perfectly white! I carefully weigh the small amount of dye needed to get the colour and no more, and then dye the material until it has taken up all the dye and the water in the pan is almost totally clear. There is hardly anything to pour down the sink.

Here is my cooker with the stainless steel pan I use for dyeing...



... and here is my sink...



Spotless - apart from the dirt!

On the subject of WOIGO deer hair, here is my latest effort. I like the palest bits of roe as a base...



That is 80% EBEST fluo yellow : 20% Jacquard Aztec Gold.

Col

Perhaps you can dye and I'll buy off you ;)
 

Cap'n Fishy

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Perhaps you can dye and I'll buy off you ;)

Seriously - it's dead easy to do and gives you control over your colour. Buy from someone else and the colour you get sent is a bit of a pig in a poke. It's the same as tying your own flies and buying someone else's. And like fly-tying, it's a good side-hobby in its own right - puts another string in your bow and gives you more satisfaction - not only are you catching fish on flies you tied yourself, but tied on materials you dyed yourself. (y)

Col
 

arkle

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A few moments ago, I was in contact with Paul & persuaded him to re-join, as he's a "lapsed" member. He's given me lots of info & some pics by p.m., so will try & copy & paste them... though not sure if fbk will allow that, but here go's. No sorry, it won't work, probably citing security/anti-hacking etc,

So very basically & condensed :- The colour came from Sam MgGowan & was supplied in various shades on his sika deer hair, with various references to Rogan's though Veniard's G/O is nothing like the ideal colour. Sam's materials are quite bright, so Paul now dyes his own, which he cals "Golden Olive" & the colour isl a"warm golden/ginger, There are a few photo's of dyed capes included, The main one is on a Chinese white & looks gorgeous. The next is on a light to medium red game, again possibly a lower grade one, that's had the same dye & just has a slight colour wash to it.
 
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arkle

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Have just tried to post some images, but think Ill have to do it over the next day or so, as the images seemed a bit over-sized,,,,
 
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