Split-Cane rods;

Uncas

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Jul 6, 2019
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Yorkshire
I have been reading about a new line that's available from the U.S. the DT has a longer front and mid taper and is slightly thinner to go through the rings on a cane rod, it is supposed to work better in the wind than normal lines even Sylk lines.
It's a specialized line for split-cane rods,
Rush-river 406 lines, has anyone tried them over here.
 

three rivers

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Apr 13, 2017
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I use cane rods mostly, as my fly fishing is predominantly on small streams and I prefer cane to carbon where short casts are the order of the day. I use half a DT line and the join to the backing rarely leaves the reel. I am not a fan of short rods either. I have one seven footer which only gets used when wading overgrown stretches; it is a considerable handicap when bank fishing. Mainly I use rods between eight and nine feet to give me a bit more reach over the marginal reeds and vegetation that are common on the waters I fish; the extra length also helps keep a bit more line off the water. Ten feet would be even better, but then the bankside trees start to become a hindrance when casting. What I really need is a rod of seven feet for casting, and ten feet for reaching!

My stock of cane fly rods is as follows:

7' 4 weight fast dry fly action, built by me on a Chapman blank (Richard Walker taper)
8' 5 weight built by me on a Chapman blank (Garrison 212)
8'2" 5 weight Pezon et Michel Ritz Parabolic, made for Farlows in 1968 (my favourite fly rod)
8'8" 5-6 weight Sharpes Eight-Eight (Farlows branded) from 1972
9' 6 weight Hardy Phantom from 1965
9'6" 7 weight Hardy Halford Knockabout from 1955 - this is used solely for sea trout, and occasionally on lakes when the mood strikes me.

I wouldn't for a second suggest cane is the best rod material for use on large stillwaters or saltwater fly fishing, nor would I tell anyone else what they should use; we fish for pleasure, so use what pleases you. If I am in an efficient mood, I will cheerfully use a 10' Daiwa Whisker, which will cast as far as I could ever want, effortlessly; if I am feeling more relaxed and ambivalent about catching a limit, the Hardy does nicely.
 

nymphist

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Sofia,Bulgaria
I use cane rods mostly, as my fly fishing is predominantly on small streams and I prefer cane to carbon where short casts are the order of the day. I use half a DT line and the join to the backing rarely leaves the reel. I am not a fan of short rods either. I have one seven footer which only gets used when wading overgrown stretches; it is a considerable handicap when bank fishing. Mainly I use rods between eight and nine feet to give me a bit more reach over the marginal reeds and vegetation that are common on the waters I fish; the extra length also helps keep a bit more line off the water. Ten feet would be even better, but then the bankside trees start to become a hindrance when casting. What I really need is a rod of seven feet for casting, and ten feet for reaching!

My stock of cane fly rods is as follows:

7' 4 weight fast dry fly action, built by me on a Chapman blank (Richard Walker taper)
8' 5 weight built by me on a Chapman blank (Garrison 212)
8'2" 5 weight Pezon et Michel Ritz Parabolic, made for Farlows in 1968 (my favourite fly rod)
8'8" 5-6 weight Sharpes Eight-Eight (Farlows branded) from 1972
9' 6 weight Hardy Phantom from 1965
9'6" 7 weight Hardy Halford Knockabout from 1955 - this is used solely for sea trout, and occasionally on lakes when the mood strikes me.

I wouldn't for a second suggest cane is the best rod material for use on large stillwaters or saltwater fly fishing, nor would I tell anyone else what they should use; we fish for pleasure, so use what pleases you. If I am in an efficient mood, I will cheerfully use a 10' Daiwa Whisker, which will cast as far as I could ever want, effortlessly; if I am feeling more relaxed and ambivalent about catching a limit, the Hardy does nicely.
Nice selection of cane. I tried a friends 8'2 PeM Ritz once and i found it very sweet rod indeed. How would you compare your Hardy Phantom 9 #6 1965 / i have exactly the same year and model/ against your 8'8" 5-6 weight Sharpes Eight-Eight (Farlows branded) from 1972?
 

three rivers

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Apr 13, 2017
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88
Nice selection of cane. I tried a friends 8'2 PeM Ritz once and i found it very sweet rod indeed. How would you compare your Hardy Phantom 9 #6 1965 / i have exactly the same year and model/ against your 8'8" 5-6 weight Sharpes Eight-Eight (Farlows branded) from 1972?
They are similar. The Phantom is noticeably more powerful. The Eighty-Eight flexes deeper and has a slower action, albeit with a soft top.
 

lhomme

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Dec 21, 2010
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Location
Antwerp
I use cane rods mostly, as my fly fishing is predominantly on small streams and I prefer cane to carbon where short casts are the order of the day. I use half a DT line and the join to the backing rarely leaves the reel. I am not a fan of short rods either. I have one seven footer which only gets used when wading overgrown stretches; it is a considerable handicap when bank fishing. Mainly I use rods between eight and nine feet to give me a bit more reach over the marginal reeds and vegetation that are common on the waters I fish; the extra length also helps keep a bit more line off the water. Ten feet would be even better, but then the bankside trees start to become a hindrance when casting. What I really need is a rod of seven feet for casting, and ten feet for reaching!

My stock of cane fly rods is as follows:

7' 4 weight fast dry fly action, built by me on a Chapman blank (Richard Walker taper)
8' 5 weight built by me on a Chapman blank (Garrison 212)
8'2" 5 weight Pezon et Michel Ritz Parabolic, made for Farlows in 1968 (my favourite fly rod)
8'8" 5-6 weight Sharpes Eight-Eight (Farlows branded) from 1972
9' 6 weight Hardy Phantom from 1965
9'6" 7 weight Hardy Halford Knockabout from 1955 - this is used solely for sea trout, and occasionally on lakes when the mood strikes me.

I wouldn't for a second suggest cane is the best rod material for use on large stillwaters or saltwater fly fishing, nor would I tell anyone else what they should use; we fish for pleasure, so use what pleases you. If I am in an efficient mood, I will cheerfully use a 10' Daiwa Whisker, which will cast as far as I could ever want, effortlessly; if I am feeling more relaxed and ambivalent about catching a limit, the Hardy does nicely.
Nice collection and your favourite rod being a P&M brought back memories. I worked for the firm (Sensas) that bought the company and ended the era of "le bambou refendu" they were famous for. Much to my regret, but they had no eye nor sense for nostalgie and quality, what counted (and still does) was mass production and turnover. That's why they bought mine as well and used it to beef up their own line of products. I believe one or two, I only spoke to one (Christian, if I remember well), went on to make rods on the P&M tapers, but I'm not sure if they still do.

Here's some more info on the history of the company and your rod. Only available in French I'm afraid.

 
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airsprite

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Dec 3, 2009
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Birmingham
Out today for a few hours on a small brook, nice shady day below the tree canopy.
Usually this time of the year the Mayfly is in full swing here, but very few about.
Have i missed an earlier than usual hatch, or have the floods washed them out.
I really don't know, anyone else experiencing the same?
With the brook so low a rare outing for my Constable Midge 6ft 6in, which is a true 3 weight.
Managed a few small fish, a couple on drys but most on Hares ear nymphs.
All in all a joy to be out.IMG_2249.JPGIMG_2251.JPG
 

kevin55

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Dec 14, 2010
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Location
London NW; originally from South Derbyshire
Out today for a few hours on a small brook, nice shady day below the tree canopy.
Usually this time of the year the Mayfly is in full swing here, but very few about.
Have i missed an earlier than usual hatch, or have the floods washed them out.
I really don't know, anyone else experiencing the same?
With the brook so low a rare outing for my Constable Midge 6ft 6in, which is a true 3 weight.
Managed a few small fish, a couple on drys but most on Hares ear nymphs.
All in all a joy to be out.View attachment 27200View attachment 27199

A use so rare you might consider selling it, only to regret it later?
Most 6' 6", 7' rods seem to be 4-5 so I'd love a 3 wt
 

Uncas

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Yorkshire
Come on nymphist tell us what rod & reel you have in this picture, we would all like to know.
 

nymphist

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Sofia,Bulgaria
Hardy Phantom Holokona 1965 9 #6 2pcs , Thebault level #4/5 natural silk fly line, Hardy Ultralite disc #6 reel, CDC dry fly.
 

three rivers

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Apr 13, 2017
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Do you find the 4/5 line works with that rod? My Phantom seems if anything to want slightly more than a #6 - more like a 6 & 1/2. It's never been happy with a no 6 DT Hardy Perfection line, but it works well with a no 6 DT Aircel Ultra, mainly I think because the Hardy line has a longer taper.

Mind you, I've never used a silk line on it, though I can't see that it should make any difference. Perhaps being a level line it compensates by presenting a mass equal to a heavier, tapered line.
 

lhomme

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Antwerp
Would a cane rod be suitable for 2lb trout from a small stillwater ?
Weird question, maybe another one might answer it. Would cane rod users never have caught fish over 2lb before glass and carbon came on the market? I've landed many trout well in excess of that figure on cane and I'm sure many others did.
 

nymphist

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Do you find the 4/5 line works with that rod? My Phantom seems if anything to want slightly more than a #6 - more like a 6 & 1/2. It's never been happy with a no 6 DT Hardy Perfection line, but it works well with a no 6 DT Aircel Ultra, mainly I think because the Hardy line has a longer taper.

Mind you, I've never used a silk line on it, though I can't see that it should make any difference. Perhaps being a level line it compensates by presenting a mass equal to a heavier, tapered line.
It depends how would you define "work" . If you intend to cast all line and a few meters of backing to the horizon, i would guess no. But in fishing situation within 20m range its ok. Also note that a natural silk line has a 30% less diameter than a same # weight class plastic line and cuts through the air with less resistance because of the smaller diameter for the same weight. Also if you really need a heavy line at certain moment you could apply more grease which will make the silk line heavier and will load the rod better, but you should clean the line carefully completely from the extra grease after fishing. In fact my fishing distance in the rivers i fish doesn't require heavy lines for distant casts, 15m is a long cast in my river fishing, in fact my next natural silk fly line would be #1-2 for the same rods i fish now.
As you mentioned hardy perfection fly line - i had a wf5 perfection and sold it after the very first fishing day because it was too light / i didnt measure it but it felt more like a #3 weight/ to load even my featherweight plastic hardy Ultralite 8'6" #5 , 67g measured by me fly rod.
 

three rivers

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It depends how would you define "work" . If you intend to cast all line and a few meters of backing to the horizon, i would guess no. But in fishing situation within 20m range its ok. Also note that a natural silk line has a 30% less diameter than a same # weight class plastic line and cuts through the air with less resistance because of the smaller diameter for the same weight. Also if you really need a heavy line at certain moment you could apply more grease which will make the silk line heavier and will load the rod better, but you should clean the line carefully completely from the extra grease after fishing. In fact my fishing distance in the rivers i fish doesn't require heavy lines for distant casts, 15m is a long cast in my river fishing, in fact my next natural silk fly line would be #1-2 for the same rods i fish now.
As you mentioned hardy perfection fly line - i had a wf5 perfection and sold it after the very first fishing day because it was too light / i didnt measure it but it felt more like a #3 weight/ to load even my featherweight plastic hardy Ultralite 8'6" #5 , 67g measured by me fly rod.
I am familiar with silk lines and their ability to cut through the wind, but I've never thought they enable you to use a lighter line for any given rod; a five weight is (or ought to be) the same weight whether silk or plastic. Like you, most of my fishing is done inside 15 yards - in fact most of the time it is inside ten, including the combined length of the rod and leader, so I often only have five yards or so of fly line beyond the rod tip. If necessary I'll go up a line weight rather than down, to load the rod sooner.

Evidently from the photo the line works for you, which probably just means you're a better caster than I am. I must admit I struggle with light lines, even on rods well-suited to them.
 

nymphist

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I am familiar with silk lines and their ability to cut through the wind, but I've never thought they enable you to use a lighter line for any given rod; a five weight is (or ought to be) the same weight whether silk or plastic. Like you, most of my fishing is done inside 15 yards - in fact most of the time it is inside ten, including the combined length of the rod and leader, so I often only have five yards or so of fly line beyond the rod tip. If necessary I'll go up a line weight rather than down, to load the rod sooner.

Evidently from the photo the line works for you, which probably just means you're a better caster than I am. I must admit I struggle with light lines, even on rods well-suited to them.
The slicker profile of the silk fly line makes them easy fliers, in fact i am using the same thebault #4/5 on my much heavier than the hardy phantom - Allcock popular fly rod in the below photo. I am not sure if i am better caster, the dry fly cast from the phantom rod fish photo was within around 12-14 yards that should not be a problem. Also when nymphing the mass of a doble nymph bead head rig should be added to the equation, sometimes i have to use quite heavy nymphs to reach the depths fast and for such a short distances of within 10m i don't like to use heavy fly lines.20180828_205836 - Copy.jpg
 

Uncas

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Yorkshire
Weird question, maybe another one might answer it. Would cane rod users never have caught fish over 2lb before glass and carbon came on the market? I've landed many trout well in excess of that figure on cane and I'm sure many others did.
Best not get aggravated at a beginner in cane rods, after all we need as many interested people fishing cane as possible.
 
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