The problem with knots!

len1

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I’ve been fishing for about nine years since I retired and I still get the occasional knot failure with the curly tail as evidence. Talking here about 8lb. Fluoro. Fulling Mill.
I was taught the five turn improved clinch knot. Usually OK sometimes fails. Highly experienced fishing friend recommended seven turns. Still sometimes fails. Now trying out seven turn NOT improved clinch knot.
What’s your ‘go to’ knot with fluoro?
PS Never have this problem with 15/20lb. Maxima when salmon fishing. Mind you I have never caught that many salmon! Lol.
 

webblade

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I second the Davy and Double Davy I've been using it 3 seasons and never have trouble with it. Very easy to tie also.
 

JCP

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Fulling Mill is a ''healthy'' diameter compared to some. Try the knot in dry dock to test it.Try pulling the knot up slowly without wetting.Alternatively as suggeted try the Davy/DD but be aware must pinch have the tag at 90 degrees becuse if it rolls as you seat then it too will slip.
 

BobP

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Don Staziger did a piece on knots some while ago that improved my tying of the 5 turn tucked half blood knot enormously. Bear in mind that no knot is absolutely safe, but the 5 turn knot as shown by Staziger runs out at around 94% which is pretty damned good.

He wrote to tie the 5 turn knot as per usual and having done the "tuck" to then hold the main stem and the standing end between finger & thumb together and draw away from the hook eye. This ill pull that standing end up under the knot. Having done that then "inch" the knot down to the eye with the line well wetted. When drawn up tight the standing end should stick out at about 90 degrees from the knot.

Doing more turns does not improve the knot. In fact it is more likely to do the opposite.
 

Tangled

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All our usual knots are good and the tucked clinch knot is perfectly fine.

But ALL knots occasionally fail because something went a bit wrong in the tying. The solution is to test every knot you make.

I learnt this the easy way by watching a very experienced, professional guide tie a fly on for my mate. He tied it, put the hook in the finger ring of his forceps and pulled it like crazy. It failed! He did it again and it failed again. The third time it stuck. He wasn't doing anything wrong that I could see.

Since then I've properly tested every knot and I reckon 1 in 10ish don't hold. But I've never had a knot fail in a fish since.
 

JCP

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Don Staziger did a piece on knots some while ago that improved my tying of the 5 turn tucked half blood knot enormously. Bear in mind that no knot is absolutely safe, but the 5 turn knot as shown by Staziger runs out at around 94% which is pretty damned good.

He wrote to tie the 5 turn knot as per usual and having done the "tuck" to then hold the main stem and the standing end between finger & thumb together and draw away from the hook eye. This ill pull that standing end up under the knot. Having done that then "inch" the knot down to the eye with the line well wetted. When drawn up tight the standing end should stick out at about 90 degrees from the knot.

Doing more turns does not improve the knot. In fact it is more likely to do the opposite.
I would only add the pulling up slowly was passed down to me on this forum in 2019.Prior to that I always accepted fishing folklore and wetted the line/knot on setting it.Have changed my mind.Slow and dry definitely does the job on trout fishing flurocarbon.Of course this does not mean wetting the line is detrimental to the knot but I have had well known knots in fluorocarbon slip fortunately in dry dock so gave the slow hand set a go and happy with it.
 

Cap'n Fishy

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For me, the safest of all is the half grinner. The end cannot possibly pull through and give you a 'pigtail' fail. I've been using it for all nylon and fluoro for decades.

Only issue with it is it uses up dropper at too high a rate, so for droppers I use a half blood knot. I do not bother to tuck it as I think that gives an ugly, deformed knot. I just tie a 6-turn half blood knot. After tightening, I pull the tag against the dropper. This twists the fly round, making the tag point upwards. I then pull the fly against the dropper. This makes the tag jump down into a horizontal position. I know when I get that 'jump' that the knot is locked and will not slip.

Col
 

len1

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The plethora of knots suggests the perfect knot has not been found. I thought it was only me that lost the odd fish to a duff knot.
Also suspect that with ageing eyes and cold fingers I sometimes miss the wee loop near the eye with my tag end which can be hidden when tag end is tucked. If you know what I mean.
 

JCP

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The plethora of knots suggests the perfect knot has not been found. I thought it was only me that lost the odd fish to a duff knot.
Also suspect that with ageing eyes and cold fingers I sometimes miss the wee loop near the eye with my tag end which can be hidden when tag end is tucked. If you know what I mean.
That is the beauty of the last knot recommended.You will have a job to miss the loop in a Half Grinner/Uni knot...Think might well be the answer to your prayers.👍
 

len1

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That Uni knot looks the business. No way to miss that loop. Davy knot a wonder of minituarisation! I’ll play with them all before my next outing.
 

webblade

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I would only add the pulling up slowly was passed down to me on this forum in 2019.Prior to that I always accepted fishing folklore and wetted the line/knot on setting it.Have changed my mind.Slow and dry definitely does the job on trout fishing flurocarbon.Of course this does not mean wetting the line is detrimental to the knot but I have had well known knots in fluorocarbon slip fortunately in dry dock so gave the slow hand set a go and happy with it.
I also don't wet my Davy or DD knots as I've had them slip when I wet them but no problem doing the dry.
 

len1

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Been using the Davy knot for three weeks now. That’s six stockie bashing trips. More then 24 fish. A few around the 3 and 4 pound mark and one yesterday about 8lb.
No knot failures. No pig tails. Happy man. Thanks for all the advice.
 
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