Welded/braided loop failure - advice?

PaulD

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This is why I like the needle knot, one I did yesterday on a 5wt line with the butt section of a 15ft leader constructed with 0.45mm Stren Original (20lb BS). It has not yet had its thin coat of superglue which will seal the end of the fly line, add to the security of the knot and make the joint smoother.

Needle knot.JPG
 

original cormorant

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I make my own loops with a generic 20lb braid for my trout lines and never had one fail. I whip them on and don't use any tubing as pulling it in and out of the tip ring can knock it off/loosen it.
As I do except that I do use a bit of shrink tube over the end of the braid to prevent fraying.
Plus I have three different sizes of braid for different lines up to #12.

I've been a braided loop believer for abou 30 years.
 

codyarrow

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Another +1 for braided loops. Had one failure only. Use them for my salmon fishing - handle 10lb + fish in full spates.
The day it did fail I found myself smiling tying a knot and tippet lasso - takes you back to the early 80's.
 

shropshire_lad

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This is why I like the needle knot, one I did yesterday on a 5wt line with the butt section of a 15ft leader constructed with 0.45mm Stren Original (20lb BS). It has not yet had its thin coat of superglue which will seal the end of the fly line, add to the security of the knot and make the joint smoother.

View attachment 28255
Same method as used by Mackenzie-Philps where he needle knotted a big butt tapered leader on. That's the method I used years back but the biggest butt leaders now sold do not look quite so "big butt". Nylon is then attached to the end to make up rest of leader and the tapered bit will last for several outings.

Lots off methods, lots of answers, all useful, thanks.
 

shropshire_lad

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If the end of the fly line in the picture is how it was after the braid went then there was a fault with the line because that has snapped. If it had pulled off it would be obvious from damage to the fly line eg some of the plastic coating would most likely have pulled off.
I don't think I will ever know Bob. Looking again at the line, the last three inches have quite a few "lacerations". I'm not sure why that is, whether it's the part that originally had the braid sleeve over it or if the end of the line had got damaged in some way.

It seems overall that there's a fair bit of confidence in braided loops amongst most if they are constructed and fixed properly so I'll fit a Moser and take it from there (y)
 

3lbgrayling

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There are a couple of easy fixes to save your day.
1st.Nail knot a bit of leader to your flyline and then put a loop in this.then do a loop to loop with your leader(.I actually do a grinner nail knot)
2nd oldest trick in the book.just put an overhand knot at the end of fyline and put a loop in your leader.Fold this over to fig of 8 and put over knot and pull tight.This was the method of choice for decades.

Jim
 
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mrnotherone

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If I’m only carrying one rod I change my leader from time to time and so a loop is easiest. Roman Moser loops are excellent and I have never had one fail. I attach them as Paul describes above.

if you want to use a nail knot fair enough, but don’t be convinced by the anti loop faction. Moser loops are excellent if attached properly.

ps: I don’t like or trust welded loops.
 

JCP

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Afraid in enlarged picture the line looks damaged a fair way back from the tip which looks shredded with the core frayed out.If line did not snap then in shop installed braided loop failed or you panicked and jammed the brakes on and something had to give.Cannot stop those Farmoor rockets in full flight.Looks to me like a serious parting of the ways took place:eek:.Loops make life easy reservoir fishing.I have not used a nail knot since the 70's as a front line connection.Moser Minicon Loops work fine.I use them on 5wt to 8wt lines.Just make sure follow instructions to the letter.Another bullet proof option is to buy a 4ft steep tapered mono furled leader from forum member Mr Trout with a tippet ring finish to attach your leader and build your leader from there.Attach the plain ended fly line to the furled leader loop using a ''Castwell Knot''.Has never failed me but this set up is purely for a floating line nymph fishing set up.If one line has to cover several options on the reservoir then in all honesty Welded Loop or Moser Minicon is your best bet in my experience.Good luck it is a downer when this happens and only serves to sew the seeds of doubt.

JP
 
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cgaines10

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It looks as though your flyline has snapped. This can happen when superglue is added as it makes the coating go brittle. Eventually over time it'll start to hinge and a good tug will snap it, as you found out unfortunately on a fish and not a snag.

I use them and never had one come off, I secure using a nail knot and that thing will not come off.

If you're wanting to go down the nail knot route, use maxima (y)
 

shropshire_lad

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It looks as though your flyline has snapped. This can happen when superglue is added as it makes the coating go brittle. Eventually over time it'll start to hinge and a good tug will snap it, as you found out unfortunately on a fish and not a snag.

I use them and never had one come off, I secure using a nail knot and that thing will not come off.

If you're wanting to go down the nail knot route, use maxima (y)
Thanks, do you mean you put a nail knot over the braid for extra security?
 

speytime

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Thanks, do you mean you put a nail knot over the braid for extra security?
Yes nail knot the braid then push the sleeve over it or aquasure over it, a knot or whipping and aquasure passes through the guides better imo but a tight fitting sleeve is fine.
Imho a tight sleeve is paramount to reliability with loops.

Al
 

cgaines10

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Thanks, do you mean you put a nail knot over the braid for extra security?
Yes nail knot over the braided loop, I use it for trout, sea trout & salmon and never had one come off.

You could also do it as this video shows, same difference (y) either way, it's not coming off & you've got loop for easy attachments for leaders.

 

Jeltz

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I thought I had....... :cry:
I usually test my rigs to destruction to see how much force they can take, this tells me if my knots and line are up to the task, is the glue still holding? a fish of a lifetime doesn't come along every day. I call those situations, lessons learned the hard way and for future reference, not to be repeated. :D
 

JCP

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Which size line are we talking about here ? Too much belt and braces can have an adverse effect.With braided loops must ensure the tip is inserted right to the base of the loop and encased there in a double wall of braid.Simple nail knot tool will make the extra security process if deemed necessary really easy and neat.Just a smidgin' of glue/aquasure and good to go.Will sometimes use this method on non Moser Minicon braided loops.Prefer to thread whip over where the line enters a non Moser Minicon braid sleeve as feel the heavier plastic sleeves encourage cracking and tend to ''bump'' through the guides.

JP
 
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