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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
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    Welland Valley
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    4,160

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Quote Originally Posted by Cap'n Fishy View Post
    The thing is Terry, you could end up sitting there, going through your whole fly box with the owner, getting judgment passed on 100s of different flies. Is an Invicta OK? How about a soldier palmer? A cormorant? A size 14 damsel imitation v a size 8 longshank goldhead damsel? Hundreds more to check...

    Half-hogs...

    OK?


    OK?




    If I had to walk round and check with the owner every time I felt like changing a fly, I would go elsewhere.

    Col
    I think need to fess-up, last fished Goldenloch a couple of years back and caught on a half hog! Should add, it's a lovely fishery with fond memories for me as it was relatively close to where my late parents lived.
    Last edited by olive_dabbler; 22-12-2017 at 01:28 PM.

  2. #12

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Quote Originally Posted by olive_dabbler View Post
    I think need to fess-up, last fished Goldenloch a couple of years back and caught on a half hog! Should add, it's a lovely fishery with fond memories for me as it was relatively close to where my late parents lived.
    I have never fished it, though I have passed the road-end many times when heading for Lindores Loch (when it was a boat fishery). I wouldn't have any problems with easy to follow rules, such as floating line only, or one fly only, or barbless flies only. I tend to avoid places that have rules regarding what constitutes a 'fly'. Having been brought up on places like Loch Leven, in the 60s and 70s, amid kingfisher butchers and Dunkelds and such like, to me a fly is a fly is a fly. Some are imitative and some are not. Montana Stonefly, anyone?

    It's one of my best lures - still use it today. Not that I'm an 8 longshank-orientated man - I spend over half my season fishing dry fly, and much of the rest pulling traditional wets... you know... lures. It's just that I'm not going to try to commit flies to strict pigeon-holes. The majority of the waters I fish are Fly Only, but they are all waters where no one questions what a fly is. Fly rod + fly line + flies = fly fishing. We all have our own voluntary code of what we feel constitutes a fly. I have yet to use a squirmy wormy. I might have a go one day. Meanwhile, I have fished alongside folk who have been using them, and I'm blummin' sure I've taken the opportunity to wind them up rotten for doing so.

    I totally appreciate that the owners of small fisheries set their own rules and are keen to discourage dubious practices, so I'll wish them all the very best - not an easy way to make a living. I will just need to stay away, I think.

    Col
    Please note that any views expressed in this post may be those of the
    originator and do not necessarily reflect those of the reader.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
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    Luxembourg
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    3,688

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Hey Col;

    I get what you mean as one of my favorite summer flies is an Amyís Ant and iíve yet to see anything like that flying around! I do think that most flies have the profile of something that lives in the water. Most lures/traditional wets have silhouettes that resemble small fry if you think about it and North country wets with their minimal tying do resemble a nymph profile with legs or gills. Your Montana stonefly despite not being a UK native does have a general buggy profile which does match local nymphes. I know the purpose of the owner in France is to avoid folks fishing with pellet flies or with flies that by being stripped fast stimulate an attack. His wish is to try and limit tactics to dries and sight nymphing when possible both of which are hindered when trout are spooked by having multiple lures/streamers/wets stripped by at high speed.

    Take care

    Terry
    20 years ago we had Johnny Cash, Bob Hope and Steve Jobs. Now we have no Cash, no Hope and no Jobs. Please God, don't take Kevin Bacon.

  4. #14

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Quote Originally Posted by Vermontdrifter View Post
    avoid folks fishing with ... flies that by being stripped fast stimulate an attack...
    The thing is - when folk like me fish a big loch from a boat, we are doing exactly what your man is trying to avoid. We are pulling our traditional wets at an un-natural speed, compared to anything that trout feed on. We stimulate the fish into giving chase and into taking our flies. Any time I fish a small, stocked fishery, I will almost certainly be fishing differently, but I don't like to rely on someone else's arbitrary, loosely-defined rules regarding what I can or can't fish with. As far as I'm concerned I'm within what I consider to be the 'spirit' and general ethos of 'fly-fishing'. If a place says fly-only, I'm fine with that. If there follows a big list of qualifiications regarding what the owner's definition of a fly is, I will probably just choose to go elswhere. If the owner is that fussy, then I'm going to feel that he's watching me through binoculars while I'm fishing (cf what you said in your first post), and that is not my idea of fishing for fun.

    Col
    Please note that any views expressed in this post may be those of the
    originator and do not necessarily reflect those of the reader.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Luxembourg
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    3,688

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Fished Loch Gorm on Islay exactly as you described so know where youíre coming from! See the issue is that you assume that everyone is as ethical as you! Youíre there for the pleasure of FISHING not catching although that is part of it. I think the rules are there to control the folks who are into catching as opposed to fishing if you get my drift. As to being watched through binoculars thatís okay so long as itís not through a scope! Place I go the owner takes a walk around the area in the a.m. and the p.m. but as itís limited to 15 fishermen on an area with more than twelve hectares of land you donít see him for about five minutes of conversation which is normally spent discussing fishing and dispensing advice if youíre having no luck!
    20 years ago we had Johnny Cash, Bob Hope and Steve Jobs. Now we have no Cash, no Hope and no Jobs. Please God, don't take Kevin Bacon.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    625
    Blog Entries
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    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Hi, guys, this situation is really about the new and I mean flies that are not really anything like fishing flies, they are more in the imitation worm/maggot category, snakes, squiggles, mop, and others but its because Dunkelds, Kate McLarens, Kingfisher Butchers and others that do not resemble anything natural my argument has no substance, with guys that are progressive hungry anglers, we have a nice respected clientele here and they are not policed by any means, however local fisheries and me sometimes as well but not so much are encouraged to overstock as we need to make the fishing easier when it gets tough, just so guys catch fish but then sometimes you get quys arriving that just hammer the fish and they are the ones using this new generation stuff, biggest problem by far has been the lack of rising fish for some reasons we seem to have lost the early and late rises

  7. #17

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Quote Originally Posted by johngolden View Post
    ...I mean flies that are not really anything like fishing flies, they are more in the imitation worm/maggot category, snakes, squiggles, mop, and others...
    Hi John/

    I appreciate you will not have your troubles to seek, doing what you do. There is every chance that if I were to show you my fly box, you would say: "They are all fine, carry-on." (I do have a few orange blobs in there, though - purely for medicinal use, you understand... )

    Col
    Please note that any views expressed in this post may be those of the
    originator and do not necessarily reflect those of the reader.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    May 2008
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    Midlands Reservoirs
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    2,696

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    So you can't fish a squirmy worm under the bung because thats almost bait fishing and not a natural imitation.

    Yet a buzzer static on a floater or under an indicator is fine

    How about a hares ear ....its the best pellet fly there is ....but I guess thats natural to a stockie so ok

    Goldhead damsel.....lure or nymph....?

    A Minkie is a natural imitation of a fry...


    How about a nice bushy Oakham's orange....a traditional pattern but probably banned especially if ripped back on a fast glass.

    I'm glad I don't have to fish such a fishery.....and I guess your equally as glad I don't turn up.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    May 2008
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    Midlands Reservoirs
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    2,696

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Might be easier to ban any fly over 2 inch in total length ...that should be easier to police and will help keep the atmosphere etc...

    What is traditional or natural is impossible to police and so subjective..


    Besides would fishing a natural fly at the wrong time of the year be allowed ?.....as this in itself would be unnatural and so against the spirit of your fishery rule ?

  10. #20
    guest54 Guest

    Default Re: So Do many agree with this

    Moan all you like about it but a fishery owner has every right to set any rules he/she wishes, you don't have to fish there if it displeases you.

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