Understanding Buzzers

[Rhithrogena]

Good effort Tangled - an interesting thread

 

[JohnH]

Seems like it may have originated in the 1950s:

Elwyman - I can certainly recall Brian Harris publicising the diawl bach in the old Angling magazine in the early 1970s...

 

[GEK79]

Seems like it may have originated in the 1950s:

View attachment 30341

As a kid my father being Welsh the little devil Diawl Bach he knew as a traditional Welsh fly that his father also used so we're back in the 50s at least.

 

[mackiia1]

Very good. You give a brief mention to traditional flies, such as Black Pennel. I'm sure there's a host of other traditional wet flies worthy of mention, many of which are still killer flies today. Blae and Black and Diawl Bach spring to mind. I probably catch more on Diawl Bachs than modern buzzer patterns.

Years ago ,a small Peter Ross was a fly used by some on Corrib at Duckfly time .

 

[smallmouth]

Nice one tangled, a very interesting post and subsequent thread.

I spent some time sat at the vice during lockdown, trying to imitate this.......

.....which I think I saw first on here? and then on a facebook group accompanied by a video.

So far my efforts look too much like #14 striped candy canes for my liking, though I did catch a fair lump of a rainbow just on one presented just sub surface the other week.

I'd never heard of the Chromie until you started this thread.

Cheers

 

[Elwyman]

Found out another good reference to the original Diawl Bach, I suspect it was originally tied slightly earlier than the 1950s, but it's certainly not as old as the traditional flies we often refer to.

From a 2009 article:
Another fly-tier of note was Thomas Thomas, or Twm Twm to all his acquaintances, who over half-a-century or more ago lived between Llangurug and Cwm Ystwyth.
He was an incredible fisher and conjured up great flies. His hallmark was the red head he gave to many of his flies. He was the one who devised flies like Teifi Pools Sedge, Rhwyfwr Coch, Diawl Bach, Potsiwr, Twm Twm and Pluen Biws

A fly by any other name... was probably dressed by a Welshman

MOST keen anglers will always ensure that their tackle is well oiled in readiness for the new season.

www.walesonline.co.uk

 

[Elwyman]

However! Another claim to fame.....

Would be interesting to hear if anybody has any more information about the origin of the Diawl Bach.

 

[Elwyman]

Apologies to Tangled.....I didn't mean to hijack your excellent thread on buzzer fishing!

 

[iainmortimer]

This is a very good article and covers off the various fishing methods and fly styles used without being difficult to understand or being ambiguous. An excellent bit of work as far as I’m concerned.

 

[bignedkelly]

I have heard it numerous times on Corrib - The Duckfly swarming over the Islands look like smoke - from a distance . Get close enough and you will hear the smoke 'Buzzing' .View attachment 30331View attachment 30332

Used to see this on Loch Leven
You would see what looked like a big dark tornado shapes above castle island then it would disappear and a minute later there would be buzzers everywhere.

 

[Suposincer]

Great read! learnt some things I thought I wouldn't!

 

[Craig808]

Hi all. I've been reading this thread with much interest as buzzer fishing has become one of my go-to methods.

However, I do not ever use an indicator, I've never felt the need to. Am I missing something?

Generally, the takes tend to be quite solid and I don't seem to miss many. I am now wondering if I am actually getting more takes and I'm just unaware because I have not been using an indicator??

 

[BobP]

Hi all. I've been reading this thread with much interest as buzzer fishing has become one of my go-to methods.

However, I do not ever use an indicator, I've never felt the need to. Am I missing something?

Generally, the takes tend to be quite solid and I don't seem to miss many. I am now wondering if I am actually getting more takes and I'm just unaware because I have not been using an indicator??

The short answer is probably. It will depend how you fish them. If you are fishing deep, and by deep I mean 10'+ in early season, then I would say you are definitely missing takes through not feeling them. Fish stuffing buzzers down deep do not go charging around in the cold waters of early spring, they just mooch along scooping up buzzers as they go.

Draw yourself a diagram on a piece of paper. A flat line to represent the water surface and put another line on it to represent your fly line. Then draw another line at about 30 degrees downwards to represent your leader. Now ask yourself how much a fish down there at 10' has got to move that fly in order for you to feel it as a pull in the hand. I'm no mathematician, but it looks like quite a long way to me and I doubt that any trout is going to keep on swimming once he has discovered that what he thought was a buzzer isn't.

A yarn indicator located at the junction of fly line and leader will give you that take indication. You won't feel it, or only on odd occasions, but there is no mistaking it when that indicator goes under. Just occasionally you will get the distinct impression, and it is no more than that, that the indicator is travelling upwind. It probably isn't. more likely that a very slow moving trout has taken the buzzer and the indicator is actually still in the water, but the waves going past it makes it appear that is is moving upwind. React instantly. This a method where you have to rely upon your instincts. If it looks odd it probably is, so hit it.

If you are fishing later in the season when the fish are higher in the water and hunting hard then an indicator isn't necessary. The fish are travelling quickly and when they take the fly you know about it.

 

[Craig808]

The short answer is probably. It will depend how you fish them. If you are fishing deep, and by deep I mean 10'+ in early season, then I would say you are definitely missing takes through not feeling them. Fish stuffing buzzers down deep do not go charging around in the cold waters of early spring, they just mooch along scooping up buzzers as they go.

Draw yourself a diagram on a piece of paper. A flat line to represent the water surface and put another line on it to represent your fly line. Then draw another line at about 30 degrees downwards to represent your leader. Now ask yourself how much a fish down there at 10' has got to move that fly in order for you to feel it as a pull in the hand. I'm no mathematician, but it looks like quite a long way to me and I doubt that any trout is going to keep on swimming once he has discovered that what he thought was a buzzer isn't.

A yarn indicator located at the junction of fly line and leader will give you that take indication. You won't feel it, or only on odd occasions, but there is no mistaking it when that indicator goes under. Just occasionally you will get the distinct impression, and it is no more than that, that the indicator is travelling upwind. It probably isn't. more likely that a very slow moving trout has taken the buzzer and the indicator is actually still in the water, but the waves going past it makes it appear that is is moving upwind. React instantly. This a method where you have to rely upon your instincts. If it looks odd it probably is, so hit it.

If you are fishing later in the season when the fish are higher in the water and hunting hard then an indicator isn't necessary. The fish are travelling quickly and when they take the fly you know about it.

That's very helpful, thank you.

Even in the winter I've found that fishing buzzers within the top 4 to 6 feet has worked for me so I've never ventured any deeper. One of the waters I fish is deep as well so maybe I'll try my di3 next time and see what results I get.

You mention fishing deep and that takes would be harder to feel and that makes sense. You also mention tieing the yarn at the junction where the fly line meets the leader. If I'm fishing really deep then I assume I'm on a sinking line and if that's the case how will I see the yarn?

Unless I'm completely missing something here?

 

[BobP]

That's very helpful, thank you.

Even in the winter I've found that fishing buzzers within the top 4 to 6 feet has worked for me so I've never ventured any deeper. One of the waters I fish is deep as well so maybe I'll try my di3 next time and see what results I get.

You mention fishing deep and that takes would be harder to feel and that makes sense. You also mention tieing the yarn at the junction where the fly line meets the leader. If I'm fishing really deep then I assume I'm on a sinking line and if that's the case how will I see the yarn?

Unless I'm completely missing something here?

Two points there Craig. I assume you fish the smaller stillwaters. A good friend of mine who fishes small stillwaters more often than I do made the point that the trout in those smaller waters behave differently to those in big reservoirs. I tend to agree. I've caught quite a few trout fishing size 16 buzzers static under an indicator no more than 3' down in winter and even there the takes were visual rather than tactile.

I could fish my usual reservoir, Farmoor, for a week like that and catch nothing because there the fish would be 30' down feeding on monster bloodworm and fry.

The second point. When fishing deep in the spring it is floating line work. My usual set up is an 18' leader, normally straight through and about 8lb bs. Two flies about 5' apart. The point fly is a weighted buzzer, size 10 or 12 carrying a 2.8mm tungsten bead. The dropper fly is usually a superglue buzzer, size 12 and black.

If you aren't used to casting long leaders, don't panic about it. just tie it on and cast. You will by now have worked out that the leader is longer than the rod and how the hell is that going to work? The answer is to make the indicator small enough to pass down through the rod rings. It's quite easy to do.

Once you are set up just cast out. Don't strive for distance, just go for an easy cast and concentrate on getting it straight. Once it's out there fish it dead slow across the ripple, retrieving just enough line to take up any slack that develops. When the indicator goes, hit it!

 

[Craig808]

Two points there Craig. I assume you fish the smaller stillwaters. A good friend of mine who fishes small stillwaters more often than I do made the point that the trout in those smaller waters behave differently to those in big reservoirs. I tend to agree. I've caught quite a few trout fishing size 16 buzzers static under an indicator no more than 3' down in winter and even there the takes were visual rather than tactile.

I could fish my usual reservoir, Farmoor, for a week like that and catch nothing because there the fish would be 30' down feeding on monster bloodworm and fry.

The second point. When fishing deep in the spring it is floating line work. My usual set up is an 18' leader, normally straight through and about 8lb bs. Two flies about 5' apart. The point fly is a weighted buzzer, size 10 or 12 carrying a 2.8mm tungsten bead. The dropper fly is usually a superglue buzzer, size 12 and black.

If you aren't used to casting long leaders, don't panic about it. just tie it on and cast. You will by now have worked out that the leader is longer than the rod and how the hell is that going to work? The answer is to make the indicator small enough to pass down through the rod rings. It's quite easy to do.

Once you are set up just cast out. Don't strive for distance, just go for an easy cast and concentrate on getting it straight. Once it's out there fish it dead slow across the ripple, retrieving just enough line to take up any slack that develops. When the indicator goes, hit it!

You're correct, I do fish small stillwaters.

Yeah I fish a similar cast to you, 15 to 18 foot. I alter the point fly for where the fish are. I use a fab to keep everything higher then swap it for a heavier buzzer when the fish go deeper.

I used the above casts on a hover line last week which gave much better results than I usually get on a floating line. The hover is new to me but it's obviously given me confidence to use it again.

With regards to the retrieve I really do find that I need to mix it up from one day to the next. I've had days where I need to fish them almost static, to days where only a really quick jerky almost stripping retrieve works. Raygill is often like that. It surprises me how fast I have to retrieve because I didn't think naturals moved that fast.

Always learning though.

 

[Tangled]

With regards to the retrieve I really do find that I need to mix it up from one day to the next. I've had days where I need to fish them almost static, to days where only a really quick jerky almost stripping retrieve works. Raygill is often like that. It surprises me how fast I have to retrieve because I didn't think naturals moved that fast.

Always learning though.

You're using the buzzers as lures if you're fishing them like that. Not an issue, just saying.

 

[Craig808]

You're using the buzzers as lures if you're fishing them like that. Not an issue, just saying.

If that's what they're taking then that's what they're taking.

Trust me, I found it very strange. The first time it happened I'd decided that buzzers weren't on the menu so started to bring them in to swap tactics. Within a couple of inch of speeding up...bang, straight into a fish. Cast back out and started to jerk them in but nothing. Sped it up... into another . This carried on.
So far I've had this retrieve work on 3 occasions and all at Raygill.

 

[Paul_B]

If that's what they're taking then that's what they're taking.

Trust me, I found it very strange. The first timer it happened I'd decided that buzzers weren't on the menu so started to bring them in to swap tactics. Within a couple of inch of speeding up...bang, straight into a fish. Cast back out and started to jerk them in but nothing. Sped it up... into another . This carried on.
So far I've had this retrieve work on 3 occasions and all at Raygill.

No problem with what you're do as buzzes can be lively little buggers at times

 

[iainmortimer]

You're correct, I do fish small stillwaters.

Yeah I fish a similar cast to you, 15 to 18 foot. I alter the point fly for where the fish are. I use a fab to keep everything higher then swap it for a heavier buzzer when the fish go deeper.

I used the above casts on a hover line last week which gave much better results than I usually get on a floating line. The hover is new to me but it's obviously given me confidence to use it again.

With regards to the retrieve I really do find that I need to mix it up from one day to the next. I've had days where I need to fish them almost static, to days where only a really quick jerky almost stripping retrieve works. Raygill is often like that. It surprises me how fast I have to retrieve because I didn't think naturals moved that fast.

Always learning though.

On the small stillwaters I fish, if you get a flat calm in winter (or any time of year) I find that a hover line can make all the difference as it stops any wake from the retrieve. If you can’t carry two lines then even just adding a sinking braided leader to a normal floating line will help.